Yesterday was the 2nd day or do-over race here in Dallas at the Matrix Challenge. It was the exact same course run at the exact same time, just a day later. The day was different though. It was 15 degrees warmer, mid to upper 80’s, and more windy. That made a huge difference to a lot of the riders in the race.
The wind made the course much harder. And the heat, even though it wasn’t scorching, increased the attrition rate dramatically. All around, it was a pretty hard day, especially for me.
It doesn’t matter what you do for training, there is no way you can replicate the efforts put out in the first criteriums of the season. Or any criterium for that matter. It is impossible. I know some of you might think that is wrong, but let me tell you, it isn’t. We probably rode 50-60 laps of this course. The were always two corners you had to jump out of at nearly 100%. And at least 2 more out of the 8 that you usually had to jump out of pretty hard. So that is a minimum of 200 full out efforts in 90 minutes. And it could be as many as 250 +. Can you imagine saying you going to go out and do a speed workout and do some jumps and think, I should do around 200? I think not. You might do 10-20, but no way 200.
Anyway, the race was hard. At least for me. I felt better most of the race than the day before, but not good enough to participate really. I just rode around mildly gassed the whole day. I had some good moments, but mainly I was hurt. I don’t know how many riders out of the 80 finished, but it was pretty small compared to the day before.
They had some pretty good primes both days. Heath Blackgrove won $400 for a small points series over 3 laps in the middle of the race. There were lots of $100 and $150 primes. I didn’t contest one.
It looked like it was going to come down to a field sprint when they switched from time to laps. There were 5 laps to go, which meant less than 8 minutes the speed we were going, but finally a Mexican guy and a Elbowz guy rolled off the front. Elbowz had at least 3 more riders at the front and it was done. The last couple laps, they tried to let more guys go, but it was pretty much all together on the last lap, other than the 2 that were away.
I was in pretty good position with 1/2 a lap to go. I got into a little bit of an intimidation spate with Jason Waddell with 2/3 a lap to go. I came up on Jason’s inside before a corner and he was going to loose the Elbowz leadout, so he decided to push me on my hip from behind. I’m not sure if Jason realizes that isn’t a good position to be in. The guy ahead has way more ability to control the situation than the rider behind. It wasn’t a big deal, but I am absolutely against riders touching each other on purpose for any reason in a bike race, so I threw an elbow his way and just kept going.
The next long stretch, I had got up to maybe 5 or 6 guys back, but was in the wind. I somehow got into the middle of the Elbowz leadout, bumping Tyler Jewel off Heath I think. Tyler told me to move and give them a little respect. It is amazing to me that a guy might think that with 300 meters to go in a criterium, with 4 tight corners before the finish, that there might be some form of bike racing etiquette to allow a rider to have a team mates wheel. Maybe he was just nervous or something, but it is a free-for-all at that point and there isn’t anything close to that etiquette there. But, I was out in the wind too much the last 200 meters and could barely get to the line after blowing a couple corners. I came in 8th in the field sprint, which was 10th in the race.
I was pretty happy to be finished with the weekend. I hope I got some kind of form out of the races. I don’t know. I can’t be too displeased because I wasn’t really concentrating on the races as much as some other things, but it is painful racing that way. I’m heading back up to Kansas for a day before heading back South to Joe Martin. It is going to be a busy week I think.
When they make the movie of the Matrix Challenge, Day 2, Ed Harris will play Tyler Jewel, and Alec Baldwin will play Steve T.
Jewel: Hey! Have some respect! What’s your name?
Tilford: Eff you — that’s my name.
Love it!
sorry I missed ya, love that course, I’d gladly pay the entry fee just to be able to haul ass around those corners for an hour.
How about you try staying out of the way from now on? You’re strong enough to sneak in but get your doors get blown off when the real sprinting starts and end up being in everyone’s way. This has been your idea of racing crits for the past few years. You haven’t been close to a sprinter for quite a few years. You chop people off of their teammates wheels and you call it racing. It isn’t racing, it’s called being a punk. You preach on this blog about racing and how to race, but the fact is that you are a wheel chopping opportunist. You employ antics that are unsafe and end up making the race more dangerous, not less. Racing is about competition, but we are no longer paid professionals. Your lack of respect for your fellow competitors at the level you now race makes me and others lose respect for you and your past accomplishments.
ps: the only reason you didn’t end up on the ground after swinging over on me is because I didn’t want to crash the guys following us going into that turn. I’m fed up with (as are many less vocal than I) your crappy antics in the waning moments of races.
Let’s see…where did I put that popcorn? I’m going to need to settle in for this…
Jason-I could address your comment a million different ways. I don’t have all day.
But, I’ve seen you push, head butt and do lots of different things throughout the years that make anything I do seem innocent.
Have you ever seen me touch another rider in a race? Have you ever seen me knock another rider down in a race from a move? Ever? If you have to pull your brakes on the last lap of a criterium because of something I do, then too bad.
My rules are that as long as you don’t touch anyone or knock anyone down in the last lap of a criterium, then just about anything else goes. Your rules seem to be when you loose ” your position”, you try to physically gain it back. It don’t work that way.
And I’m sorry, but your idea of a leadout at the end of some criterium by a team needs some sort of respect is just ridiculous. Each rider is trying to get to the finish line in the best place they can. I guess in your bike racing world, we should have just let the all Elbowz guys get in line and they could have finished 3-6th at the end. I guess all the other guys swarming the front or diving the inside of a corner, including yourself the day before with Chad, constitute a breach of the “Jason Waddell criterium etiquette”.
You do what you do and I’ll do, and write, what I do. That’s what this is all about really.
I have some questions
Is what Jason said true?
Steve what reaction would you take if if a guy jumped your teams train?
I’ve always believed that if a train gets jumped then it wasn’t going fast enough 😉
Thomas, in the pro ranks, you see guys jump into other teams trains, all the time. Nothing says you have to race for 9th place, because some team has an 8 man train in front. Don’t be stupid, as long as you don’t actually shove or headbutt someone, anything goes. If a guy swings a little too wide on a corner, and you take the wheel he had been on, it’s his loss. I had that happen at Worlds in 2009, he was from Russia I think, and he took his hand off the bars, and tried to shove me back off the wheel. Didn’t work. After the race, he yelled at me for taking his wheel. UCI officials said it was just sour grapes, and denied his protest. All’s fair if it’s legal, you don’t have to get beat, just because another team has more riders.
Yes, I’ve protected my position from riders trying to come over on me in a dangerous manner. That is within the rules. I can handle it, always have and always will. I will protect my skin and bones from people that take unnecessary risks.
However, you portrayed me in your blog as the perpetrator, when actually you came over on me in an aggressive manner and I used my elbow to protect myself from being crashed by your riding. I didn’t take my hands off the bars. The reason you got bumped is because you were riding dangerously and I didn’t feel like crashing.
You are a chopper, plain and simple. You think what you do is clean racing within the rules. Forcing your bike over on someone else as you pass them making them hit their brakes to avoid a crash is not within the rules. You have this misguided idea of the style of racing you employ actually being okay.
Let’s be clear, this isn’t about me. It’s about you and your riding. You called me out and made it about me. I’m bringing to light what everyone in the races you do says about the way you race your bike.
Chad and I make clean passes. We don’t chop people and use our hips to force people to slam on their brakes. Do we ride aggressive, yes. But we do it safe.
In the last few laps if a few teammates are together it’s usually for a reason. You seem to think that you somehow have a right to bust that up. Just because you can doesn’t mean you should. Busting into a leadout or taking a teammate of another teammates wheel is plan and simple crap racing. Everyone but you seems to know this.
Your style of riding lacks the respect of your years.
This is Tyler jewell and I didn’t say a word to you all weekend .So please don’t put my name on quotes that I never said. Also we didn’t even do a lead out on Sunday we let mat roll the dice,and it was every man for himself in the end.
Tyler-Sorry. I thought it was you, but it must of been Gonzo or someone else. . He was talking from behind and I didn’t get a look. I assumed it was you because you won the field sprint and I didn’t remembering passing any of your guys at the end.
If he said “yo, give us a little respect, B!” then it was Gonzo 😉
And down goes Frazier!!!!
I’ll take door number 1: the guy who worked his way through the pros and paid his way through law school to become an Assistant D.A. and help protect society over door number 2: a guy who USED to race pro and built a fence last week.
Peter-Do you have a prejudice against fence construction? Manual labor? Anything of that sort? You must because I can’t see the relevance of that comment.
Maybe you should try a little manual labor once in awhile. It does wonders.
SLAP FIGHT
Uh, no but I must’ve hit a nerve. I actually started in manual labor myself so don’t pull the social class bullshit on me. Nobody gave me a damn thing growing up except a desire to better myself. Your problem is you have gotten way past your prime in bike racing yet have nothing to do but ride your bike so you can’t get your fix, like I do racing Masters because nobody in Masters has the time to train like it, but you can’t come to grips with the fact you aren’t a “Pro” anymore.
Peter Erdoes–champion of the 50 plus criteriums–once again going out of his way to prove he’s a jerk.
PeterE, you’re a piece of shit and most of us on TXBRA know it, although it’s been a while since you’ve been spewing it. Nice to see you still have some form.
PS: And one more thing; people who chase ambulances for a living, probably shouldn’t tell others how to make a living.
From reading Steve’s blog I get the impression that he loves racing and that it’s a big part of his life and that’s okay. It’s his lifestyle and he’s arranged how he lives in a way many others either won’t or aren’t able to do. If he wants to ride and that’s what brings him joy in life that’s great. Success isn’t always measured in dollar signs. I don’t get the haters. Waddell is an okay cyclist but at his very best he and many others who have made the same sacrifices were still at best some bush league pros who on their best days could maybe mix it up with the big boys. Not a dig. When you some of the biggest wins of your career have been regional omniums and crits, now you’re 38 years placing top 10 at some Texas crit, I don’t think there’s a chance Pat Lefevre will come knocking.
As well, when you’re playing for keeps in the closing laps, that leadout crap makes its own fortunes on legs and grit not depending on others “respecting” that team formation. If you’re getting swarmed, sack up and up the pace ’cause it aint’ fast enough. Only someone scared and desperately attempting to cling on to a higher level would have that entitled “give me respect” view. So is making some backhanded low-blow comment about a man’s working background. Quit yapping and ride. Or don’t ride. Who cares about your 50+ crit jammed between the Cat4/5 and kiddie races.
Keep racing and writing Steve.
I’m confused – when I watch a ProTour sprint it can be amazing mayhem, with riders jumping all over the place to gain an advantage, including on another’s train. Head butting, shoulders, elbows all touching to the line.
And Waddell is complaining about someone grabbing his guy’s wheel, then having to put an elbow on him so he can sprint for 6th? I don’t see anything that Steve wrote indicating Waddell was to blame for anything but leaving a gap.
Meatball Friedman wrote about how HTC was bullying the domestic pros in the Tour of California a couple of years ago. The intimidation was to prevent breaks from forming so they could bring their man home in Santa Rosa. This sounds like a similar etiquette problem…except TT evidently didn’t have a closer. Oops.
4 words. Joe Martin Stage Race. Round 2 could be this Sunday.
Bill Simpson you are my hero today.
Erdoes and Wadell were knobs back in the day, and it seems they’re knobs now. It’s good to know that despite getting lawyered-up nothing changes.
Lots of comparisons between a regional texas crit
and the big leagues here. Maybe think that over.
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@BillSimpson: “Waddell is an okay cyclist but at his very best he and many others who have made the same sacrifices were still at best some bush league pros who on their best days could maybe mix it up with the big boys. Not a dig. When you some of the biggest wins of your career have been regional omniums and crits, now you’re 38 years placing top 10 at some Texas crit, I don’t think there’s a chance Pat Lefevre will come knocking.”
Oh Bill, working a full-time job while racing on the NRC circuit from the east coast to west coast placing consistently plus doing regional events makes me bush league? I rest easy knowing what I accomplished and what I didn’t accomplish. This isn’t about my career, or lack thereof, it’s about how Steve rides. I just happen to be the one who will be vocal about it.
I’m 38 placing in the top 10 because I love racing my bike. After six years and law school I came back to bike racing because I love it, just like Tilford does.
My problem is that Tilford portrayed me as the one in the wrong and I wanted to offer another side of the story, one his minions weren’t getting.
Your lack of understanding the respect amongst riders at a level you don’t understand is why you shouldn’t be commenting.
Yeah and you were in the wrong. Protecting your spot is okay, just don’t do it once you are passed by trying to elbow someones hip. You know that.
Nice job of telling us that you would have crashed him if it wasn’t a danger to the other riders behind you. I would love to have been at that court hearing. “well your honor I purposely crashed him because I was losing the wheel in front of me and he passed me for it.” Thats nice.
This is the reason the RBR boys always were punking on you. You take racing a little too serious. As you know there are more important things in life. Like sitting at coffee shops taking pictures of your coffee and of yourself wearing aviators inside.
Jason-I “portrayed” you in the wrong because you dug your elbow into my hip instead of doing nothing or pulling your brakes.
You stated, “The reason you got bumped is because you were riding dangerously and I didn’t feel like crashing.” That isn’t true. You were trying to keep your position, that you had lost, by making physical contact. No one was in danger of crashing and you know that. If it would have been any other lap of the race, it would have just been a normal corner.
I know you don’t like being near me in a criterium. That is fine. But head butting, elbowing, pushing hips with your hands is wrong. It disrupts the “schooling effect” of the field and is cheating. It’s not cheating to come inside someone on the final lap of a criterium. Or any lap of a criterium.
I didn’t call you out on anything but initiating body contact. You made a conscious decision to do that. It wasn’t a survival tool. You think you’re justified in using that, I didn’t and don’t. And that is what I wrote.
Mr. Erdos,
I understand you have an opinion about who was right and who was wrong in the incident being discussed. But when you jump into the fray with something that can only be described as mean spirited, you reveal much more about yourself than anyone you are trying to support or criticize.
If you want to advocate for someone, elevate the tone, please.
Here’s a question to Waddell – why didn’t you file a protest if you thought Steve was riding unsafely or is consistently doing so?
Seems like you need a ref to back up your opinion.
I still don’t get this “my train” business.
Steve Tilford, cat 4’s worship him, cat 1’s hate him.
Arguing on the internet is dumb.
Uh Rod half my work is currently representing others in Civil Rights cases and where they are being sued by others for a claim in the oilfield but thanks for incorrectly surmising what I do. And thank you gutless anonymous guy for calling me out. Having said that I regret what I said above . My apology
Jason, I do understand this level of racing, and Steve has an accurate point. I have raced with him, and i’ve never seen him initiate contact with anyone. If this was one of the classics, or the Giro, I could understand, but it’s just not. Your career doesn’t depend on your being able to hold onto that wheel. I race masters now, because I have no urge to mix it up with the pro’s, at the end of a crit. But I still see guys get reckless, and sometimes crash people, while sprinting for 15th place. I have never seen Steve reckless, just aggressive. At the level you race now, you should never touch anyone, unless it’s just to let them know you’re there. And no matter how old Steve is (I think we’re the same age) he still finishes top ten in pro races. And he races cross, so he’s a good bike handler. You act like, since you’re younger, you have some entitlement to the wheel you’re on, that’s just not true. Man up, and admit you over-reacted, in the heat of the moment, and just move on to the next race.
Someone else said it above, but I’ll say it again:
There’s a time to make a protest about conduct during a race, and there’s a “statute of limitations”. That time is gone, and so whining and complaining about it now says more about the person making the complaint than the person who is the target of the complaint.
If Steve wanted to file a criminal complaint against you, if Texas law is anything like Kansas law, then making physical contact in a “rude, harmful, or offensive” manner, along with the bad intent to do so, is the offense known as battery. You just confessed to doing so, in a public forum, where the evidence you gave is admissible in trial against you. Reach out your hand and push Steve’s hip in order to shove him aside, and here in Kansas, you’d be looking at a year’s probation – supervised – probably a pretty good fine, up to $1000, six months underlying, and anger management therapy. On top of which, since you’re a lawyer, you’d get reported to the lawyer’s disciplinary authority. I’m not sure what they do in Oklahoma, though.
Moreover, if you used your bike as a weapon to “crash” other riders, that’s aggravated battery, and here in Kansas, that’s a felony. You seem to demonstrate the intent to do so sometime in the future when you say “the only reason you didn’t end up on the ground after swinging over on me is because I didn’t want to crash the guys following us going into that turn.” That statement could be used by a prosecutor to push things past the limit of a “reasonable doubt” in a criminal case. It’s possible that might come up to the standard of criminal threat. As a practicing attorney, as you claim to be, you should have picked up on these things in law school, not only as violations of criminal statutes but also as violations of the code of professional conduct of attorneys…
cat4 domestique, I back Waddell 110% that bar is brutal at 6 o’clock and you really need sunglasses inside!
H Luce, Everything you say is true. However you are a moron for thinking that I would be charged with a crime for holding my line and causing both Steve and I to crash when he swung over on me and chopped my line. I chose to use my elbow to protect myself from him obstructing my line, forcing me into the rider beside me (who probably appreciated it) and then let Steve have the position and not cause a crash.
Speaking as a prosecutor, and former professional cyclist, you really don’t know what the hell you are talking about.
If “everything [I] say is true” then what’s your point? When he “swung over on you and chopped your line” he did something known as “blocking” – was he about to hook your wheel? did he hit the brakes? If you were able to push him away with your elbow on his hip, then you were even with him, not in a place where he could hook you – and you made physical contact with him. You fouled him, and not the other way around. You’re the one with the dirty tactics, not Steve.
Hey Dan. Could you pass the popcorn this way, please?
Best chat fight ever?
Jason-In my post I said it wasn’t a big deal. I kind of think you’ve blown it out of proportion. Both you and I know that no one was crashing there. (There was no one beside you. You were up against the curb. ). So quit trying to portray yourself , and your elbow of course, as the savior of the majority of the field from not crashing.
You don’t like the way I ride. I get it. Sometimes I don’t like the way you ride, such as this instance. That is just how it is.
What you should have done is to have maintained enough situational awareness to have noticed him coming up on you from the side, and to have jumped up and stopped him from getting in your line – if you’d done so, then he’d be at risk of going down. You didn’t do that, you screwed up, then you elbowed him in the hip. That’s a foul.
True about the law, oh wise one. The cat 4 minions have it all figured out today. You make a lot of assumptions about an incident based on something you didn’t see or experience. Please refrain from calling me a dirty rider as you neither compete against me, know my character, nor actually know how I race my bike.
My beef has been and always will be about the way Steve rides. I don’t appreciate it, neither do lots of other riders. I just vocalize my frustrations. I’m sure there are plenty that don’t like the way I ride, but that’s the way life generally is and we all move on.
lawyer Jason better not be billing my ass while you’s getting is a tiffy up hear on the interwebs!
I just want to know if “Roberto” is of the Gaggioli type? If so, I am with him. I raced with you (Roberto) in a couple of Athens crits. Always fair, always fast. Damn fast.
“I used my elbow to protect myself from being crashed by your riding. I didn’t take my hands off the bars. The reason you got bumped…”
and
“ps: the only reason you didn’t end up on the ground after swinging over on me is because I didn’t want to crash the guys following us going into that turn.”
Those are your words, Jason, and those are your acts. You admitted to deliberately fouling Steve. You also made an implicit threat to have Steve “end up on the ground,” and stated that you refrained from doing so only because there were other riders coming up quickly. Those are dirty tactics, plain and simple. People who do that kind of stuff don’t belong in any kind of sport.
” I just vocalize my frustrations. I’m sure there are plenty that don’t like the way I ride, but that’s the way life generally is and we all move on.”
After protracted whining.
Really, this minion is serious – if Steve rides out of bounds or you do it’s the ref’s call. Steve expressed his angle as “it’s racing”. You, despite being a DA and knowing process, refuse to protest. The system is in place to change behavior; if no sanction follows it looks pretty bad for the protester as he is considered both wrong and whiny.
I think you know the probable outcome of a protest.
Question for Joe Martin promoter? Are there any good finish line tickets still available?
The best quote is the one about Gaggioli always being fair. I doubt John Brady feels the the same way.
Oh my, it’s true: http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/1579871836/image.jpg
only thing lamer than 2 roadies trying to “fight” is the same 2 roadies going at it on the interwebs. this funny, keep it up
Only those that have raced at the Pro level know anything about racing. Glad I know that now. Thanks Jason. BTW it’s only a race you are not saving lives.
Steve good job at being civil I guess they don’t teach that in law school.
He’s only a Assistant DA because his grades weren’t good enough to get a summer internship at a firm.
Racing hasn’t changed much over the last 30 years. But back then the cat fights were private.
I am concerned that, as Jody noted, two attorneys have engaged in intimidation, personal attacks, and sarcasm. Mr. Ergos’s apology is appreaciated As lawyers, we should elevate to civility of discourse. Mr. Waddell, perhaps a private communication to Mr. Tilford would have resulted in the modification of his racing style which you seek.
He may be a “chopper” in your eyes, but to many of us he is a Hall of Famer, a cycling legend, and an inspiration to still be competing with (and pissing off!) pro’s as he passes the half century mark.
SPersonally, I respect the life choices he has made and read his blog as my daily zen moment. I wonder how many of us read at our desks and wish we were in California riding with Hampsten, hanging in Steamboat with Kent Erikson, nursing cats back to health in Kansas, or winning yet another World Cross championship in Europe (or Kentucky.)
Regardless he absalutely has earned more respect on his own website than what has been exhibited by my legal brethren today.
I am concerned that, as Jody noted, two attorneys have engaged in intimidation, personal attacks, and sarcasm. (Mr. Ergos’s apology is appreciated) As lawyers, we should elevate the civility of discourse. [We should also be able to freakin’ edit our comments, hence the double post.]
Mr. Waddell, perhaps a private communication to Mr. Tilford would have resulted in the modification of his racing style which you seek. He may be a “chopper” or even a “punk” in your eyes, but to many of us he is a Hall of Famer, a cycling legend, and an inspiration to still be competing with (and pissing off!) pro’s as he passes the half century mark.
Personally, I respect the life choices he has made and read his blog as my daily zen moment. I wonder how many of us read at our desks and wish we were in California riding with Hampsten, hanging in Steamboat with Kent Erikson, nursing cats back to health in Kansas, or winning yet another World Cross championship in Europe (or Kentucky.)
Regardless, he absalutely has earned more respect on his own website than what has been exhibited by my legal brethren today.
Jason Waddle. Some biker team named Elbowz. Elbowz? Wow. Neat use of that letter Z.
Waaaaaaahddle. It’s MY train. Stop racing me. I’ll hit you with my elbowz, man! Waaaaaaah.
Tilford is a real bicycle racer. And you, Waddle, are a whining douche-bag.
Going off on a tangent, Gaggioli has been a douche from the time he set foot in America. I had forgotten about the incident with Brady (IIRC, Gaggioli and Brady were sprinting for the finish in a big SoCal crit. After the finish line Gaggioli kicked Brady in a way that caused him to crash and break his femur). Additionally, after a crit in Alabama I think, Gaggioli attacked Jonny Sundt with a 2×4.
Getting back to the original Matrix situation, there is a give and take. Nobody likes riders who dive bomb the last corners of a crit. I’m not saying that was happened in this case, but it happens often and it makes people mad. On the other hand, some of the tactics of a train can get nasty too. Again, I’m not saying that was the case at Matrix. There is a lot of aggression and intimidation that happens in the last laps of a crit. Despite all the words, insults, and dick measuring that have been written on this column, nothing is going to change.
Guys-We’ve all said everything needed on the subject, actually too much, so maybe we should focus on something more productive and enjoyable.
I like this one:
https://stevetilford.com/?p=18942#comment-7522
I came here for an argument!
http://www.montypython.net/scripts/argument.php
In other news, Heath Blackgrove won $400. That’s a lot of money back here in New Zealand.
see this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAaWvVFERVA
goddamm. this is a good thread!
http://www.soulinthemachine.com/photos/library/misc/extra/arguing.jpg
Hey Erdos, If you expect any cred, since you support Waddell’s view over Tilford’s, you should dump Mr. Brown (no pun intended) from your team.
Just sayin’.
Wow, assholes like Erdoes and Waddell are exactly why I don’t and never will race my bike again. Again proving that most lawyers get into the profession because they are self-aggrandizing pricks.
Steve, love your blog, it has meant so much to me to see a man living the dream, still, living just like he wants to, and riding away from punks half his age.
I have a beard
Steve–keep writing and riding–your blog is also a staple in my daily reading and a healthy distraction from the daily grind. Despite the attacks, you’ve kept it classy and you provide inspiration for many.